Comments on: The Paypal Dispute and Claim Gotcha - Escalating Your Claim Gets It Dismissed http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/ Internet Safety, Windows Updates, Internet News, and More Sat, 21 Nov 2009 19:31:10 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3 By: A Malapaka http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/#comment-1151485 A Malapaka Fri, 13 Nov 2009 02:38:24 +0000 http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/?p=2209#comment-1151485 Paypal gotcha !! Similar thing happened to me after sending a dispute to chinese seller with no reply and after escalating the claim this is the reply i got. I will henceforth never use pay pal for payments for goods. Hello, You have chosen to escalate your dispute to a PayPal claim. By ending communication with the seller, you are asking PayPal to investigate the case and decide the outcome. As part of our investigation, PayPal reviewed any communication you may have had in the Resolution Center. Our investigation into your claim is complete. As stated in our User Agreement, the claims process only applies to the shipment of goods. It does not apply to complaints about the attributes or quality of goods received. Therefore, we are unable to reverse this transaction or issue a refund. Paypal gotcha !!
Similar thing happened to me after sending a dispute to chinese seller with no reply and after escalating the claim this is the reply i got. I will henceforth never use pay pal for payments for goods.

Hello,
You have chosen to escalate your dispute to a PayPal claim. By ending communication with the seller, you are asking PayPal to investigate the case and decide the outcome. As part of our investigation, PayPal reviewed any communication you may have had in the Resolution Center.

Our investigation into your claim is complete. As stated in our User
Agreement, the claims process only applies to the shipment of goods. It does not apply to complaints about the attributes or quality of goods received. Therefore, we are unable to reverse this transaction or issue a refund.

]]> By: tedness http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/#comment-1034836 tedness Mon, 08 Jun 2009 10:57:04 +0000 http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/?p=2209#comment-1034836 I'm a power seller on ebay and I have a person filing a claim against a item i sold with pictures showing the phone worked fine, even tested again before shipment, put in water proof plastic wrap, inside padded envelope, buyer never paid for ins through the us mail service i used, and never contacted me about item just did a dispute claim. Now paypal has taken the amount they disputed directly out of my checking account. Paypal needs to quit being shady and I'll be disputing charges with my bank. I wish there was a alternative to paypal. I’m a power seller on ebay and I have a person filing a claim against a item i sold with pictures showing the phone worked fine, even tested again before shipment, put in water proof plastic wrap, inside padded envelope, buyer never paid for ins through the us mail service i used, and never contacted me about item just did a dispute claim. Now paypal has taken the amount they disputed directly out of my checking account. Paypal needs to quit being shady and I’ll be disputing charges with my bank. I wish there was a alternative to paypal.

]]> By: Gee http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/#comment-1031189 Gee Tue, 02 Jun 2009 00:54:29 +0000 http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/?p=2209#comment-1031189 I have not had the same experience with paypal as most of you had. I purchased a phone that was said to be "LIKE NEW NO SCRATCHES" and the phone came all beat up and with a bad ESN which before bidding I asked the seller if she can guarantee it had a good ESN and she responded yes. So I followed paypals rules, the seller still said NO refund, and I escalated it to a claim immediately after she said no. Then I called about 2 days later (paypal) and got the claim expedited. No problems here. Just go into it with a nice attitude no matter what country the people are from on the other line, they're only working for a paycheck, so just be nice, they dont own the company. Attitude can take you far or hold you back depending on what kind of attitude you portray. I have not had the same experience with paypal as most of you had. I purchased a phone that was said to be “LIKE NEW NO SCRATCHES” and the phone came all beat up and with a bad ESN which before bidding I asked the seller if she can guarantee it had a good ESN and she responded yes. So I followed paypals rules, the seller still said NO refund, and I escalated it to a claim immediately after she said no. Then I called about 2 days later (paypal) and got the claim expedited.
No problems here. Just go into it with a nice attitude no matter what country the people are from on the other line, they’re only working for a paycheck, so just be nice, they dont own the company.
Attitude can take you far or hold you back depending on what kind of attitude you portray.

]]> By: SickofGreed http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/#comment-1027988 SickofGreed Thu, 28 May 2009 06:31:35 +0000 http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/?p=2209#comment-1027988 I thought I'd add to your post - apparently, if you try to do a chargeback as well, Paypal will then freeze your account. If you try to CLOSE your paypal account, you can only close it if your bank or credit card information is STILL in your profile. If you try to delete it and then close your account, they will freeze the account instead of letting you close it. The number of 'gotchas' and sneaky underhanded little tricks they have is amazing, really. The world needs to find other routes for selling, or go back to more stable ways. People like paypal are just absolute cheaters. I thought I’d add to your post - apparently, if you try to do a chargeback as well, Paypal will then freeze your account.

If you try to CLOSE your paypal account, you can only close it if your bank or credit card information is STILL in your profile. If you try to delete it and then close your account, they will freeze the account instead of letting you close it.

The number of ‘gotchas’ and sneaky underhanded little tricks they have is amazing, really.

The world needs to find other routes for selling, or go back to more stable ways. People like paypal are just absolute cheaters.

]]> By: Shaila http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/#comment-944196 Shaila Tue, 20 Jan 2009 16:35:01 +0000 http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/?p=2209#comment-944196 I paid the item I won on ebay immdeiately but seller never shipped the item, and the seller gave incorrect contact info to contact and I have escalated the paypall dispute based on item never received, the seller is non responding dont know what happens ? will i get back my money? I dont know how far the paypall wiill be doin justice to me. I paid the item I won on ebay immdeiately but seller never shipped the item, and the seller gave incorrect contact info to contact and I have escalated the paypall dispute based on item never received, the seller is non responding dont know what happens ? will i get back my money? I dont know how far the paypall wiill be doin justice to me.

]]> By: Joe C http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/#comment-941257 Joe C Fri, 16 Jan 2009 21:10:28 +0000 http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/?p=2209#comment-941257 I have found the immediate call to Paypal and a request to talk to a supervisor or mananger is the most help in situations as above... or ask for someone in the dispute department and talk to their supervisor... be insistant and keep calling... You have to actually talk to someone who has authority to do something... Thats the best advice that I can offer... also if you can, make sure to return the merchandise... if you keep it, then you are liable for it. Then you can say that technically you never received it...lol. I have found the immediate call to Paypal and a request to talk to a supervisor or mananger is the most help in situations as above… or ask for someone in the dispute department and talk to their supervisor… be insistant and keep calling… You have to actually talk to someone who has authority to do something… Thats the best advice that I can offer… also if you can, make sure to return the merchandise… if you keep it, then you are liable for it. Then you can say that technically you never received it…lol.

]]> By: PBCliberal http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/#comment-940184 PBCliberal Thu, 15 Jan 2009 17:10:37 +0000 http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/?p=2209#comment-940184 A call to whom? Paypal's highhandedness is matched only by their ability to hide out when an attempt is made to reach them by telephone. Customer service communication with them reveals their uncanny ability to identify outsourcing companies with no understanding of the actual meaning of English sentences. For those instances when we have to use them, we find their rules confusing and arbitrary. They are the paradigm of what customer service in a bad economy SHOULD NOT be. A call to whom? Paypal’s highhandedness is matched only by their ability to hide out when an attempt is made to reach them by telephone.

Customer service communication with them reveals their uncanny ability to identify outsourcing companies with no understanding of the actual meaning of English sentences.

For those instances when we have to use them, we find their rules confusing and arbitrary. They are the paradigm of what customer service in a bad economy SHOULD NOT be.

]]> By: Consumer http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/#comment-939622 Consumer Wed, 14 Jan 2009 18:38:56 +0000 http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/?p=2209#comment-939622 I've escalated claims on paypal previously (using the 'not as described' criteria) and had a successful outcome. Could this just have been a bug in the PP Disp. Reso. system? A call may be in order, or if it was partially funded w/ a CC a charge dispute since PP is the causing the problem this time. I’ve escalated claims on paypal previously (using the ‘not as described’ criteria) and had a successful outcome.

Could this just have been a bug in the PP Disp. Reso. system? A call may be in order, or if it was partially funded w/ a CC a charge dispute since PP is the causing the problem this time.

]]> By: B http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/#comment-939589 B Wed, 14 Jan 2009 17:42:54 +0000 http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/?p=2209#comment-939589 I've been there too. Unfortunately, Paypal has no way of knowing who is correct. Before this policy, I know some sellers who have had buyers reverse the payment claiming the item was incorrect or damaged. There are scammers playing both sides of transactions and Paypal has no way to know who is lying. The proof of delivery (automatic if you print the shipping label through paypal) is the only verifiable evidence that Paypal has. Everything else is the unverifiable word of the buyer and the seller. The sellers who have been ripped off by buyers were just as angry as you. For the buyer, it is no different than buying a sealed box at a flea market or from a magazine ad - you have to understand the risk and decide if you can afford to lose - if not, pay more at a vendor where you can inspect the item first. I learned the hard way too. I’ve been there too.

Unfortunately, Paypal has no way of knowing who is correct. Before this policy, I know some sellers who have had buyers reverse the payment claiming the item was incorrect or damaged. There are scammers playing both sides of transactions and Paypal has no way to know who is lying. The proof of delivery (automatic if you print the shipping label through paypal) is the only verifiable evidence that Paypal has. Everything else is the unverifiable word of the buyer and the seller.

The sellers who have been ripped off by buyers were just as angry as you.

For the buyer, it is no different than buying a sealed box at a flea market or from a magazine ad - you have to understand the risk and decide if you can afford to lose - if not, pay more at a vendor where you can inspect the item first. I learned the hard way too.

]]> By: Bill Cole http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/the-paypal-dispute-and-claim-gotcha-escalating-your-claim-gets-it-dismissed/#comment-939545 Bill Cole Wed, 14 Jan 2009 16:17:36 +0000 http://www.theinternetpatrol.com/?p=2209#comment-939545 It's a shame if anyone finds this surprising. For its entire existence, Paypal has made a consistent and mostly successful effort to provide services that replace those commonly provided by regulated financial services companies in ways that allow them to avoid being subject to those regulations. In the US and many other countries, we have come to expect protection from blatant mail-order scams from credit card issuers because they are required to provide such protection. When one chooses to work with a company like Paypal whose business model and competitive advantage are dependent on saving money by operating outside of the scope of consumer protection law, one should not expect that company to do costly things that they are not required by law to do. Eating the cost of a scam or even seriously investigating it to get a refund is not something they are required to do, and it is unremarkable that they choose not to spend that money. Of course, as a Paypal customer you really already knew this because you've read all the service terms they've ever offered you (and as a lawyer you understood them all) and so you agreed that you'd take the risk of being scammed by anyone you do business with through Paypal. Welcome to Libertarian Paradise! :) It’s a shame if anyone finds this surprising. For its entire existence, Paypal has made a consistent and mostly successful effort to provide services that replace those commonly provided by regulated financial services companies in ways that allow them to avoid being subject to those regulations. In the US and many other countries, we have come to expect protection from blatant mail-order scams from credit card issuers because they are required to provide such protection. When one chooses to work with a company like Paypal whose business model and competitive advantage are dependent on saving money by operating outside of the scope of consumer protection law, one should not expect that company to do costly things that they are not required by law to do. Eating the cost of a scam or even seriously investigating it to get a refund is not something they are required to do, and it is unremarkable that they choose not to spend that money.

Of course, as a Paypal customer you really already knew this because you’ve read all the service terms they’ve ever offered you (and as a lawyer you understood them all) and so you agreed that you’d take the risk of being scammed by anyone you do business with through Paypal. Welcome to Libertarian Paradise! :)

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